Still Open #35

Always Open: Still Open #35

Join Barbara Dunkelman, Max Kruemcke, Mariel Salcedo and special guest Griffon Ramsey, as they discuss religious views.

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Comments (74)

  • AllPurposNrd FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    4 weeks ago

    2:39 — When religions talk about meat, they generally say something like, "Be careful with that shit."

  • ElizabethMurray

    1 month ago

    It's easy to say how "offensive" Mariel was being when she said how Catholics are crazy and organized religion is shit when you're not a Hispanic who was raised Catholic. It's not offensive. Mariel saw Hispanic Catholics. They function very differently.

  • bigdong420 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    setting intentions! chaos magick

  • Teakay FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Here's my perspective as a Lutheran.


    Nobody is perfect, and churches are made up of people, so its unsurprising that churches aren't perfect either. I think a big issue is that "The Church" and Christianity are often used interchangeably, and many people assume that there is an inherent issue with the faith because of the mistakes the church has made. 


    The teachings either jive with you or they don't. Either way we're all equals, now let's go toss a frisbee around. 

  • emswimily16 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Griffon should have a podcast where she just talks about things she is interested in at that moment. She's so great at explaining things and makes me want to learn more!

  • Gcherki FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    you can't believe or not believe in a calander, its a calander, it's not more or less arbitrary than any other calander.

  • CloakaDagger FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Being super Christian and also super gay, I was a little apprehensive going into this episode, but I loved it so much. Like, I adore this podcast and each individual person on this week's episode, and I especially love when we get such a queer casting together at once. That also means, though, that discussion of religion can touch on some /especially/ sore points, believe me, I know. In the past on this show, and in general life, there's the usual assumptive joking tone that being queer by sexuality or gender and being of an organized faith are mutually exclusive, and it can be hard when both sides can make you feel like you're a contradiction; a No Man's Land. Obviously I fully understand why that is, and I sympathize with queer folks who want to dissociate the two items as hard as they can internally. That being said, when many members of your faith, and of non-faiths, and lgbtq, and cishets are all acting together like you can't belong in both camps, it's upsetting. When you're in that vesica piscis, you really have to surround yourself with a lot of queer faith friends and resources for support. So I was a little nervous about how much could happen in 28 minutes, but you guys really killed it. The discussion was hilarious, insightful, understanding, and covered a lot, as always. Everyone had something to bring to the table, and instead of being a negative or scornful look at the past and how you're "grown out of it", it was very uplifting and hopeful, and I loved the genuine interest everyone showed for each other's stories. Well done, y'all.

  • Shepsus FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Shepsus

    1 month ago

    Turns out Barb, it IS a new shirt. Funhaus shirt was just delivered. 

    How thoughtful for you to notice

  • thefunion FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Gold Stars

    1 month ago

    This video needs a counter for how many times "like" was used

  • KingofAvalon FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Jews aren't just a religious group, they are an ethnoreligious group. They are like the Amish. Yes, anyone can convert to Judaism, but the vast majority of Jews share an ethnic heritage. And the converts go through a rigorous process to become Jewish. It is more like getting adopted into a nation rather than just changing your religious beliefs. 

  • SNPmarty009 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    this podcast is great. I always get sent on these tangential thoughts watching this show. Griffon talking about how the christians won, because it's been exactly 2017 years since Jesus was crucified by romans. Louis CK talks about it in his new netflix special. And the jewish calendar is different because it's origins come with another 3000 years of history. To me, religions are difficult to inject into the 21st century. People are protective of their culture and lifestyle, as they should be, these things need to be preserved to maintain a strong identity within a classist system. For example: Religion to an Atheist is just a form of escapism. Atheism to a Religious person is just a form of escapism. Neither side should feel threatened by the other, but a foundation for coexistence is not in place under the current practices of Christianity or Islam. Do fundamental changes need to be made to these ancient institutions or are we simply evolving away from them? On the internet, we can shut ourselves away and ponder these things alone for hours, but that doesn't change anything for the people around you. It doesn't change anything for those who came before us. Perspective and respect are the two keys to a problem we haven't stalled ourselves on just yet: how do we live in unity while fostering different beliefs and different visions for a perfect world? 

    The world isn't perfect, that's why we all stare at Barb all day.

  • generalsingh FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Google Numenon. Greeks called it Numenon, Sikhs call it Naam, certain Chinese traditions call it Chi, certain Japanese traditions call it Zen, certain Christians call it Holy Spirit or the Word...this is universal truth that transcends religions and cultural boundaries that shows oneness of all.

  • SuperGhostHD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    she says haguda way differently then i was raised saying its funny to me i love it 

  • putter4 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Max...your vocab tho... flushed


  • arcangel4774 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I identify as a Methodist but don't necessarily go to church as much as my faith would suggest.  The concept I draw from this is the Wesleyan Quadrilateral: religious reflections involves scripture (what the bible says), tradition(what people have done in the past), experience (affirmation of your faith through personal experience of God), and reason (why the Bible says something or what it really means).  They type of Christians that justify horrible actions with scripture only follow the first 2 sides and strongly neglect the 4th. The Bible has 3 rules, but are expanded to many. Don't harm or do things that lead to the harm of others, don't harm yourself or do things that lead to the harm of yourself, and don't worship another god.  Unfortunately you also have to view things from the people of the time, namely that motivation was through fear, not reason (although that works just as well for our political parties nowadays)

  • TheInnerghost FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I grew up in a totally not religious family and I am super happy for it. As a kid I got to make my OWN decisions, and come to my OWN conclusions. I don't believe in God or a higher power, but I believe in being good and doing the right thing which is honestly more than I can say for most of my religious friends.

  • DanielCasey43 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Max is one seductive motherfucker

  • AnimeGamer5 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I've been a Baptist growing up and I had things happen in my life that have left me questioning God's purpose, my dad broke his spine at work almost 10 years, he's been hospitalized months at a time, we became homeless for about 5 of those. I've been depressed and I feel like without purpose, but I do believe there is a God I think it's just a matter of growing up and accepting reality. If there's anyone else who feels confused too, things can get better. I've learned to have patience and just don't stop believing and just be kind and accepting to other even if you don't agree. I wish a great day to the RT fam!

  • Beerbearian FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Possibly A Drunk Bear

    1 month ago

    I grew up going to a mix of baptist and lutheran churches, but I don't recall a time where I ever actually believed any of it. I always thought of the as just stories for as long as I can remember. Over time I've realized I'm a de-facto athiest. I can't say there is no higher power, but I think it's highly unlikely. 

  • Palmujoni FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Being raised Lutheran, I can confirm, Max's story is accurate. Every youth pastor I've ever met has been all "cool" and jokey :D There was this one youth pastor I remember who was like super cool, he didn't take the whole thing too serious and all that jazz, the only mentality he ever tried to "force" onto us was to just be good people. This guy is probably the reason why even though I'm an agnostic atheist I still have no ill will toward religious people, even though there still are shitty groups of people among them.

  • RandyKyleMci FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Something that really pisses me off about religious people is their whole "I'm praying for you". I've gone through an insane amount of crap in my life, I've died twice, I spent about 4 years of my life in a hospital, I've had a double lung transplant, and so much more that I won't say here. And when I tell people about that, they always say "I'm praying for you" or "I had been praying for you. its because of me that you're healthy now"

    Or the whole "God has a plan for you". Incase you dont know how transplant works. A good man, who was 45, had a good loving family, didn't do drugs, didn't drink, didn't even drink coffee, had kids, HAD TO DIE so my dumbass could get a few years of extra life. You take away a loving father, a great husband, so, my stupid dumbass can live a few more years. How does that make sense?

    I find when it comes to religious people talking to me about the stuff I've dealt with, they try to insert themselves and say that I'm soley alive because they prayed.

    Or the other side of religion who think I'm a sin against god because I someone elses organs in my system. Oh, I'm sorry, I had less than a month to live. Sorry for wanting to live.

    /end rant, sorry


    Its a hot button topic for me, sorry for the heavy ranting

  • Dakoba FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    23:23, Barb really missed the chance to say Menorah-ty 

  • simmonsfan33 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I also used to attend a Catholic school, but was picked on so fiercely that it kind of put me off the idea of Catholicism, since only one or two people in a school full of Catholics stepped in to do anything about it. I will never put down any religion though, and I respect the ideas Christianity can instill, because my grandfather was a Korean War vet who was able to get over his trauma through Christianity, and after years of soul searching, I found myself in a similar situation where my life was changed though in this case through Buddhism. One day, I found myself looking at Buddhist beliefs and saying "What they say makes sense". That one moment changed my life. I can honestly say I'm a better person for it, and though I'm still working on being a good Buddhist, I hasn't brought me anything but happiness.

  • noxxboxx FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    This was a great conversation that needs to happen more often.

  • TMeisterJ FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Level 5 Laser Lotus

    1 month ago

    Even if it's not related to religion having anything related to family and community gather in one place is something that can be in itself sacred and should not be taken for granted. This is going from the religious holidays/events that bring people together.

  • EzraSanchez FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I've had that exact same moment in class when (and later in boy scouts) where the teacher said "we're all Christians here" and me realizing that I wasn't one. It was honestly really empowering. 

  • BenKT88 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    An intelligent meaningful conversation here on the post show, yet somehow the only thing going through my head is 'More than a feeling'. ...weird.

    • CommanderLeopard FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Human

      1 month ago

      Well it is a pretty good song.

    • JoJo13 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Joe

      1 month ago

      Is it coz Barb is wearing a Boston shirt? ;)

  • selena902 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I was raised Catholic and I still don't get how people can believe there is a higher power. I identify with Barbara a lot on the my family was slightly religious and put the children through religious traditions. I'm currently going through my confirmation but I'm only doing it for my grandmother and because my mom already payed for the classes(lol) even though I don't believe in it. I just plan on getting confirmed and never having to deal with it again. 


    I kinda feel bad tho sometimes because during class we have talks and I'm just like ehh yikes no I don't care god says abortion is murder who is he to tell me what to do. And my peers are listening intently and seem to completely believe in this stuff, like really . I feel like I've entered another universe where everyone believes and I'm the only one sitting there screaming in my head "WHAT IS GOING ON".


    I understand the comfort that comes with religion and I sometimes wish I could believe so I could be more "normal" but I have just never actually felt anything towards god. When I try to make myself think there is a god I just feel silly and I can't take the theory of any higher god seriously. I literally started smiling to myself in class once during a discussion and when asked why I had to say it was because I was looking at the dog outside. The actual answer was I'm laughing because this entire discussion is ridiculous god isn't real why am I here, but that's not a great thing to say in CCE class... 


    I like religion because, at least in my family, it allows us to practice traditions like Easter and have an excuse to see each other and be together. I also liked going to church but only because it was a fun one where they sing and it was black-centered and it smelled so good and the pastor was cool as shit (St. Peter Claver in NOLA). rip father mike


    I've never identified as one because it would make things awkward in my family and I'd just not rather talk about it, but I guess I'm athiest. However, I like religion because of the way it brings people together and how it helps people who can believe in it. Some people need it and it makes them better people, so good for them.


    ...damn that was long

    • Liberty83 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      Just to share a personal anecdote, having been raised Lutheran and growing up / studying the sciences specifically organic/inorganic chemistry it boggles my mind when people say that they don't believe in some sort of creation type force.


      There are two huge things that within our lifetimes have come out that makes it hard not to believe.  1.  The Universe is EXPANDING.  2.  The discovery of the cellular unit, the process in which it survives and the thorough understanding of inorganic matter.   Specifically the gap that exists between life and matter and the astronomical jump in complexity found in between. 


      Something to keep in mind though is never forget the historical perspective involved (and often ignored) with most religion.  Pretend for just a second that say.... things  in the bible did actually happen.  There was a dude who came from the sky and told another dude "the earth was created in 7 days and 7 nights".  Take a step back, given what we know about human history and add some historical perspective.  Mainly - We were really dumb with our understanding of things. I always like to imagine the conversation went something like this


      Angel dude : "Wow, life really has come a long way.  You have language and community you have conquered many of the hurdles of survival to an amazing point.  Time you understand how things work!"   "So speaketh the force of creation.  There were 7 cycles before the universe was created into what you now exist on"


      Shepard Dude : "Uhh... what is a universe cycle?"


      Angel Dude : "You know, like how your planet revolves around that giant ball of gas, only on a much larger scale."


      Shepard Dude : "My what does what now?"


      Angel Dude : "That thing that comes up in the morning and goes down at night."


      Shepard Dude: "Ohhh so you are saying this God guy created everything in 7 days!"


      Angel Dude : "Well no... it was much longer than that, we were just establishing what a cycle was in terms you would understand.  The time scale of the universe is measured in hundreds of thousands of millions of billions of time units"


      Shepard Dude : "What is a millionbillion?"


      Angel Dude : "You know what, lets just stick with the 7 days and 7 nights metaphor for now"


      There is this weird phenomenon in religion where in most people refuse to apply any historical perspective to the situation and instead take them as very literal interpretations.  The bible wasn't some book carved in stone by lightning, it is an amalgamation of stories written by humans.  Humans who were at the time much more ignorant than we are now.  This is not to say we have reached our peak of intelligence, I mean if we look at the leaps and bounds we have made in the last 100, 50 or even 20 years it is simply amazing.  Look at video games, we've gone from bouncing a ball back and forth to in 1972, to 45  years later creating full on immersive worlds that people practically disappear into.  And 50 years is absolutely nothing on an evolutionary scale.


      The TL:DR I guess is that, if you try to take most modern religion as literal then you are completely ignoring our own historical perspective.  But because some people got some things wrong 2000 years ago, long before we ever understood our own personal biology or had limited knowledge of our planet doesn't mean there isn't something to the underlying idea that is there, especially given what we know now.  If anything for me, religion planted the idea of there being something more, science gave me faith, and our history gave me perspective. 

  • JoeCr FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Nice little correction for my peeps, when Griffon mentioned the stuff about philosophy in college and the thing about Kant....what I believe she meant to say was Søren Kierkegaard and his book Fear and Trembling. It talks about ethical levels, being aesthetic then moral then religious.

  • Signmysignature FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Can Griffin just talk all the time?

  • MamaKatie FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I have to say thank you to y'all for addressing this topic. 


    I wasn't raised religious, but I fell in love and got baptized into the LDS (Mormon) Church about 2 and a half years ago, and was SUPER involved. As in, I went to BYU and planned on a mission, even almost got married. Then, I came to terms with my sexuality and ended up leaving (unofficially) about three months ago. I still believe in God, and love religion (I pray and stuff but I don't go to services anymore), but sometimes I feel like I'm not supposed to because I'm gay. It's been a huge struggle the past year so I love hearing insight on it. 


    So it's nice to hear insight that's so supportive and loving, it really makes me feel better on days where I'm so confused. So thank you! 

  • lselliot FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Max, I'm sorry, I'm piss drunk, but holy fuck, you said "like" around 100 times during your little discussion you had going on... 

    • BartholomewW FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      I can't +1 this enough times

  • TodayAmazing FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I loved Griffin's insight in this.

    • Jordan_Katter FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Enjoyment Gamer

      1 month ago

      I listen to a podcast of just griffin talking about things. 

  • BD_K427 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold BD

    1 month ago

    I think this applies to what Griffon was saying about how much the universe makes sense vs your knowledge of science.

  • M19A85T FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Apart from Islam don't follow the Quran or Sharia Law to the Letter that's a bad idea.

    • kaikaips3 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      The same can be said of the Bible

    • Assassin_Moa FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Jenlad94

      1 month ago

      If Christians followed the bible and Jews, the Torah to the word, a lot of deaths would happen unnecessarily, it's definitely not just the Quran, saying that I've never read it so don't know for sure what it even says

    • Liberty83 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      To be fair Kaikaips3 most of what is considered bad/archaic in the bible comes from the Old Testament.  The old testament,  specifically the time it covered were a set of rules set up to essentially atone for the original sin of man.  (Animal sacrifices, no cotton poly blend, wife must be a virgin, etc etc) The new testament with the sacrifice of Jesus for the sins of the world was to essentially null and void all of those practices / rules and they were left with "Be excellent to each other, have faith and even if you don't live the best life there is still a chance for you".  There is no real mention of homosexuality or any of the other trigger things that most people try to give it flak for.  


      I mean there are quite a few stories that Jesus would on the regular hang out with prostitutes, lepers and the other undesirables of society and that they were "God's children" too.  The twisted thing is that people who cite those old testament laws are essentially ignoring the full story, and specifically the entire point of the second half.


      People who snap back with things like you said generally tend to either parrot what others have quoted without out understanding the full picture or haven't really read into the actual message behind it all.  Not trying to attack, merely to inform! Cheers! 


    • M19A85T FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      kaikaips3/Assassin_Moa - NO other Religion is as bad as Islam, Christians Believers are not using suicide boomers or Trowing Gay People Off Roofs Beating and Raping Women, Genital Mutilation on Women, using Acid Attacks on Women, Believing In Paedophilia, Cutting Off Limbs of criminals, 

      25 Reasons why Islam is not peaceful - The truth about Quran! - 


  • anneh24 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Don Law

    1 month ago

    I guess felt board stories are a universal protestant experience lol the norwegian evangelical church i grew up in used to bring those bad boys out every time.

  • Icky427 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Icky

    1 month ago

    i think max, at the end, said the most important thing to keep in your mind when it comes to anything to do with religion/spirituality/supernatural. "too much of a good thing can be a bad thing". im not religious (anymore. long story), but if i had to pick a religion i actually like, its satanism.

  • GreyGhost9036 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Angry Beaver

    1 month ago

    Max pretty much nailed it. As a catholic who does believe in the whole message. There are the crazies out there screaming kill the gays etc etc. and then there are those of us who are just saying they dont represent all of us. Just live and let live i say. 

  • eKlaire_the_Snail FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    You know, there's this very interesting book I read a few years ago called Waking the Buddha. It talks about an organized religion that has revolutionized the way religion affects it's members and the community. I'd recommend it to anyone who's interested.

  • DungusMcBrungus FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    Bringing up religion will always get people spicy. I'm just glad i got to hear RT have a real conversation about it, I loved it :)

  • RTLstuff FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Normal Meat Person

    1 month ago

    Weird coincidence: I literally just got out of the bath and I had been listening to The Prince of Egypt soundtrack and belting out all the songs. That is such a great film imo and I love all the songs, and I'm not even a little Jew-ish.

  • conor1302 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Tentative shriek

    1 month ago

    again, i also feel very similarly to Griffin. despite all my personal issues with religion overall, i do feel a little envious of those who are particularly religious, to be able to draw such joy and sense of identity from their religion in a way i doubt i'll ever feel.

  • conor1302 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Tentative shriek

    1 month ago

    wow, Griffon may be the only person I've ever seen who can pull off purple eyebrows

  • conor1302 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Tentative shriek

    1 month ago

    i tend to agree with mariel. i myself am very slightly religious, in that i like to believe there is some form of God or deity. my issues with religion comes mostly from religious people and organised religion.

  • Svenphen FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    I feel like a huge controversy was brought up this episode. Like, does Max really think that The Prince of Egypt is Dreamworks 2D Animation Gold Standard? The Road to El Dorado is leagues better, from the music, to the cast, to the writing.


    Also, yeah, religion.  Just, do whatever and don't make other people do what you do unless they want to.

  • KelliferReds RT accepted my Blood $

    1 month ago

    I will in fact, enjoy my witchcraft lol. I would love to hear more about Griffin's experiences.

  • JohnBrown13 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Mitchell Goodwin

    1 month ago

    This was actually very well done. Very respectful on the show AND in the comments. Kudos to everybody

  • shawncouch88 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    1 month ago

    New drinking game! Take a shot every time someone says "like". (Warning, this will result in death from alcohol poisoning.) 

  • 4viator FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Wait, what?

    2 months ago

    As a Jew, I believe in the religion, as well as a god, but I have my own path. As in, I choose what do follow, and what to believe. (I don't eat pork, but I do eat meat and dairy together/one after another for example)

  • CardinalHeart27 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    2 months ago

    I've always had a hard time understanding the seemingly general view on agnosticism, and, identifying as agnostic myself, I try to get at why it seems to be viewed negatively most of the time. From my experience watching things and hearing offhand opinions here or there on agnosticism, I think I understand it as people being upset with its seeming lack of commitment or concrete stance on the religious and spiritual, but I've never really seen declaring yourself agnostic as a cop out personally. For me, saying that I'm agnostic means that I understand the power and emotion behind believing in something more than myself, but just the concept of declaring what that thing is as any god or gods just doesn't personally click. I find a lot of affirmation in the emotion in art and music and tend to think on the side of what we see and experience on Earth as being more than beautiful and fulfilling enough that I don't really have a personal calling for praise or worship in any possible creator. But if there is anything beyond what we see, I'm completely willing to try to embrace it. Trust me, I completely understand the ideas and motivations behind being religious in the traditional Christian sense, not assuming I have the whole picture when it comes to anything else, and I can get behind Atheism in some respects, but I'm entirely open to live and love the world around me as well as anything beyond it that I can't see. I don't see why that makes me noncommital or lazy. Being agnostic has never meant retreating to a safer term than atheist or religious because of the societal implications of the words or a rain check on some final metaphysical decision for me to make. It's just me putting a term to wanting to love and know the world and universe around me and acknowledging that there are intrinsically parts of it that I don't understand and can't understand. I will admit that I have a lot of fear in terms of the afterlife because I don't wholeheartedly have faith in whether or not there is one, and that comfort in faith is a strength of religion that I miss out on. I just hope trying to lead a fulfilling and meaningful life where I do more good for the world than bad will be enough. Anyway, sorry for the long rant or if I rubbed anyone the wrong way with what I said. If I did, I sincerely apologize. That was not at all the intention of this comment. I promise an intention of open-mindedness and love and sorely regret if it wasn't conveyed, and also just wanted to articulate some bottled up feelings in words. So thank you for reading this if you did, it means the world to me. Also sorry if I sound pompous or holier-than-thou, again unintentional. In general, here's hoping this comment stream is an intellctual and open discussion and that everyone has a good day!  smile 

    • vanessa717 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      I'm an atheist, and the issue that I have with agnosticism is that it's a term that also applies to atheists, because it answers the question of knowledge, not belief. Everyone logical should be agnostic, cause it just means literally "a lack of knowledge", and no one can know for sure whether or not there is a God, atheists agree with that, any logical atheist is an agnostic atheist. But when it comes to the question of belief (which is usually what the discussion is about) if you do not actively believe in a deity than you are an atheist, which literally means "a lack of belief" in God. So by declaring yourself agnostic you aren't answering the right question, even Christians should be agnostic cause they have no way to know, so they are agnostic theists (though some claim to know for sure, they would be gnostic theists and are frustrating to talk to). People seem to think atheists are declaring there is no God, but we aren't, we just don't see a reason to actively believe in one, and we would change our beliefs if there was evidence to. And when people are afraid to use the word atheist to describe themselves it adds to the negative connotations behind it and doesn't really help anyone. It's like people calling themselves egalitarian instead of feminist, it just ends up dividing you from the people you actually agree with, just cause society has added this negative vibe to the word, and that doesn't help anything. 

    • CardinalHeart27 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      1 month ago

      @vanessa717 You make a good point about the silliness of semantics and labels in general when it comes to this sort of thing, but the reason I identify as agnostic and not as atheist or agnostic atheist is because 1) I feel like it gets across my set of beliefs less ambiguously, 2) most people don't think of the terms through the literal definitions you've given, and 3) I feel like agnosticism is a level of the spectrum between theism and atheism. When a lot of people, including myself, hear the word atheist, it is generally interpreted as the concerned individual having a complete and unshakeable belief that there is no chance of a god or afterlife. To the outside person, when they hear "atheist," they also generally hear "they don't believe in any CHANCE there's something else." Now, if the major interpretation of me saying I'm atheist or agnostic atheist was, "I don't have a concrete belief either way and feel like what's more important is what we feel and experience in this world and universe right now," I wouldn't really mind if someone said I was atheist. But most people don't think of Christians or Muslims or Hindus as agnostic theists most of the time and most people don't think in the literal logical entymology of words when they hear the word "agnostic." Language is an generally unspecific and approximate device for interpreting meaning, and saying I'm agnostic is about reaching a more easily said and understood label that approximates my belief system or lack of a definite one. I can more easily get across my stance on things by saying "I'm agnostic" rather than saying "I'm agnostic atheist with an apatheist stance on the question of whether or not the universe was intentionally created and an existential stance on the question of universal meaning" because there are less possible misinterpretations and because it's just generally easier to say. It's not about being afraid of the negative connotations of atheism for me; it's about actually getting across my more specific stance on things. This leads into how I see things in a more vague and less purely logic based way than I'm assuming a good portions of atheists do. While you seem to be agnostic atheist, having a open opinion on belief in a greater power when presented with evidence, other atheists certaintly don't and see evidence as impossible to validly appear and have a firm stance in there being no greater direction to the universe. While either stance is very much valid as much as the difference between Christian and Hindu belief is, ascribing the same term because of literal definition and entymology to both those forms of atheism as well as agnosticism tears away at more specific differences in belief. Condensing the spectrum from agnosticism to concrete atheism in terms of uncertainty into one term washes over the differences in beliefs between different individuals, and while saying "I'm agnostic" or "you're atheist" is repetitive and murky on a literal level, the use of the different labels represents a better and more specific spectrum of beliefs. Sorry again for the really long comment! But thank you Vanessa for your response. You make an interesting and thought provoking point and I really appreciate your time in reading and responding to me. Again, I hope I did my best at speaking my own voice and not manipulating or insulting the beliefs or religions of anyone else. If I did, again, I apologize. Thank you again and have a good day!!