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Create a character for RWBY

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  • AlbionBard

    AlbionBard FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574918 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD

    If he lost both arms, even if while running away, Trauma alone should have immediately sent him into shock. To say the least, this is unlikely.

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574919 - 5 months ago

    With Brock's mech suit


    I got the inspiration from Iron Man so he can detach his augments,put on the suit then reattach his arms to the suit...or something along those lines.

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574922 - 5 months ago

    In reply to AlbionBard He was in battle so his adrenaline was pumping like a rave he didn't notice till the battle was done. He created the arms back in Beacon if that kind of situation arose and perfected the augmentation when he arrived to work with Ironwood in Atlas.

  • jVictor

    jVictor FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold For Science

    #33574930 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD


    That's...not how adrenaline works. No matter how much is in your system, you would know if your arms got ripped off.  Also shock is a consequence of blood loss. It doesn't matter how numb you are, blood loss is blood loss. If he was running with blood pouring from both sockets, he would only die faster

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33574940 - 5 months ago

    In reply to jVictor

    Also in full agreement with Jvictor.

    You would 100% know if you lose your arms especially if you are running.

    The human arm total makes up around 5% of your body mass each. So to lose both is a 10% reduction.

    You would notice.


    Speaking as someone who has had a broken leg when I had the cast come off it felt like my leg wasnt there it was so light and it screwed with my balance like you wouldnt believe.

  • Angelus987

    Angelus987 Archangel of Prowess

    #33574941 - 5 months ago

    In reply to DisneyDCFan

    Ah, well that was her allusion before the change. I guess I'll have to change that up now. Thanks for pointing it out Disney, I'd honestly completely forgotten about it.

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574945 - 5 months ago

    In reply to LukePrather Brock is all my own creation 

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574948 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    In reply to jVictor Ok ok. Hmm....His arms were badly damaged they had to be amputated and replaced with augments. Sound a bit better?

  • RoseMaryM

    RoseMaryM FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold PYREverse Artist

    #33574955 - 5 months ago

    In reply to Monodramatic


    I did it. I finished the review ! Sorry it took so long @Monodramatic T.T


    Name: Roza Frammento
    Age: 36
    Race: Human
    Gender: Male
    Affiliations: Freelance mercenary, former specialist of Mistral’s military
    Allusion: Romeo

        Everything here fits and checks out. Is there a meaning for Frammento, or did you just make it up?


    ------
    Appearance: Roza strikes an imposing image, standing at around 6”4 with a noticeably lean figure and a gruff, dishevelled look to him. His sharp eyes are a piercing, icy shade of blue, boldly juxtaposed against the pale tone of the man's skin, and framed by the mop of spiky, unkept hair that falls to man's neck - silver, with red streaks that run down to his fringe, and similar highlights on the hair near the back of his neck. The mercenary dons a purposefully atypical attire, despite his more than generous wealth and previous social class. Scornful of Mistral’s society, Roza has abandoned their fashion and culture in favour of a much simpler outfit: a red and black checkered shirt, with black pants and a large, segmented plate of armour that runs down to just above the man's elbow from his right shoulder. Roza's two weapons rest in holsters on the sides of his legs.

        His looks are well described and are easy to visualise. Since he is older I can totally see him not having a super complicated outfit like some of the younger OCs here. Though, I would probably add small accessoires here and there. My best suggestion would be a necklace, or some rings of some kind? (Also I'm gonna assume he has hairy arms? It wasn't mentioned but I've seen people give older men smooth baby skin so I wanted to make sure)


    You do not mention what KIND of pants he wears? Are they jeans, or more of a uh... Satin fabric? Do they hug his legs or do they fan out at the bottom (Hello 90's Bootcut)?


    ------
    Personality: Roza is a lone wolf through and through. He lives alone, works alone, and thinks alone, always convinced that whatever path he's chosen to take is the only one right for him. The man actively rejects the influence of others out of an inherent desire to control his own life and make his own decisions, often coming across as rebellious or fractious. He has no desire to fit into some kind of hierarchy, having long since abandoned the one he was born into, and does not entertain the idea of having superiors. This all stems from the death of his former partner, the inciting event that lead to Roza's departure from the military, something which he directly blames on his superiors’ refusal to take action, and their refusal to allow him to do so. Ever since then, the man has refused to let others decide what he can and can't do.

        I'm going to cut these bits up because it's a lot of text, sorry. 


        Anyway: I like how you presented his Core personality. You write his core ideals and morals and even give a very short explanation on why he is the way he is. I like that. Personally I am someone who has high expectations for Lone-Wolf characters but Roza definitely meets these expectations since so far he has a REASON to be a lone wolf, and he has values that reflect this kind of personality.


    ------

    On the surface, this mindset has given birth to a certain arrogance, an outward cockiness that both stems from a feeling of regaining control and served as a coping method for Roza, a desperate attempt to reintroduce some fun and positivity into the mercenary’s life. He projects a gruff, confident exterior, and doesn't shy away from the occasional verbal spar. To many, Roza is defined by his apparent smugness, something which shows in his work ethics: Roza is far from ashamed of his constant advertisement, and his prices definitely lean towards the more costly side of things. That might be because Roza is more than willing to tackle some of the shadier jobs Remnant has to offer, walking the fine line between mercenary and criminal on several occasions. He's definitely partaken in his fair share of robberies and vandalism.

        I honestly cannot give much criticism as this is fairly well written and fits together rather nicely. I do like how he seems to have his own moral compass, completely seperated from what society would call 'just'. That being said though: How does he deal with the fact that some people might view his practises and views as morally wrong?


    ------

    But Roza isn't a murderer, and for all his willingness to do some dirty work every now and then, the man is still driven primarily by his morals, flexible as those may be. He'll happily take any jobs that put him face to face with some of the world's more questionable figures or companies (*cough*SDC*cough*), but he'll never attack organisations which he supports or sympathises with, regardless of what people might pay him. And yet, despite his obvious moral compass, Roza also displays a clear hatred for vigilantes and heroicism. A bit of hypocrisy, on his part. He's driven by a desire to live life by his rules and ideals, yet outwardly shuns the idea of going so far to act on them. Rather than try to change a world he disagrees with, Roza opts to just live in his own world.

    That last part is also because of his partner's death. Roza heard about how he died during the destruction of Kuroyuri, fighting to protect the civilians rather than escaping. Torn apart by the knowledge that the man could have survived had he chosen to, Roza grew to view heroic self-sacrifice as naive, pointless and foolish.

        This last part is probably my favourite. Characters stated as being hypocrites is actually pretty rare. At least from what I've seen. That being said though: I don't even know if I can ask the question of his strengths as weaknesses, since Roza is probably the first character whose weaknesses are also his strengths and vice versa. I really like that. I mean I wouldn't want to be around him much as he doesn't seem like the kind of person I'd interact with, but that's a good thing because that's exactly what you are going for I suppose.


    ------

    Weapons: Petalo Ferro - A pair of chainsaw tonfas. The Petalo Ferro are silver, with a metal casing covering the halves of the saws that would normally run parallel to the forearms, preventing any messy accidents. The saws themselves are activated by a single button on the handle of each tonfa, and that very same button can de-activate them.

        His weapon is honestly very simple. Also it seems to put him at a massive disadvantage against snipers and longer range folk. I don't know if it would be beneficial to give him a more complex weapon, though it feels a bit violent for what was established before.  


    ------

    Semblance: Roza’s Semblance, when activated, forms a large, visible bubble around him. Dark-red and spherical, the bubble has a diameter of two meters, with Roza as it's centre at all times. The Aura bubble slows objects that enter it or are within it, depending on the speed with which those objects are moving. The faster they move, the more force is exerted on them, to the point that most projectiles are simply stopped in mid-air, and anybody making any sudden movements will be brought to a halt. This Semblance is virtually impossible to simply “break” through, though it won't stop things like heat from passing through. Takes an incredible amount of Aura to sustain, to the point that Roza can rarely keep it up for more than five seconds without over-exerting himself.

        (All bubbles are spherical btw, unless there is a cubic bubble that I have just never seen) Whilst it is a pretty powerful Semblance I am glad you gave it such a short active time. It feels more natural for him to activate it for shorter periods, also it means that people who have a large clip usually have a better time with focus firing projectiles. It honestly helps point out his weakness for non-melee focused fighters.


    ------

    Fighting Style: Roza is an expert in one-on-one combat, though he somewhat struggles against a large group of competent opponents. Physically, he's still in his prime, with a body simultaneously built for speed, durability and strength. He's fast enough to dodge blows and outmanoeuvre foes, sturdy enough to take a few hits and keep fighting, and strong enough to punch a hole through most defences.

    Roza is a skilled martial artist, and a great close-ranged fighter, able to switch between offensive and defensive styles if need be, largely due to the versatility of the Petalo Ferro. If faced against a relentless attacker, Roza can use his weapons to hold his own, waiting for the right time to counter-attack, often using his Semblance to bring his opponent to a sudden halt when it's time to launch a decisive blow. Alternatively, if pitted against a more defensive fighter, Roza is capable of using the deadly power of his chainsaw tonfas to force his enemy into a corner, with his Semblance used to prevent sudden escape this time.

    Further supplementing his close-quarters ability is Roza’s knowledge and mastery of several different locks and takedowns involving his tonfas, which in practice allows him to subdue and restrain opponents easily. However, he struggles against ranged foes, due to his own inherent lack of long-ranged capabilities. This includes Dust Casters.

        This all fits with what was established beforehand and there's honestly not much else to say as it rounds out the character very nicely. Nothing of what is stated here contradicts any previous sections. Well done on that !


    ------

    History: Born into Mistral's high class, Roza spent his earlier years bathing in the culture and luxuries of the Eastern kingdom. (CUT)

    And then Kuroyuri was attacked.

    The man had heard of such attacks several times before, had watched them unfold with his own eyes throughout his time in the military. It was probably why he'd been so nervous when his partner had told him that he'd be visiting family over in the small, rural village. He'd written it off as paranoia, but the nights prior to the attack were sleepless. All that worry and creeping dread came crashing down on his soul when he heard the news, mere hours after the fact. The village had managed to get word to Mistral of the attack, sending distress signals and cries for help, but when Roza took it up with his superiors, they wrote the possibility of a rescue mission off as suicide. Too many Grimm had amassed in the village, and it would be too far away to reach them in time. Or perhaps sending soldiers there and back might attract the dreaded creatures to the city itself.

    There was nothing they could do. Nothing Roza could do.

    At first, the man blamed himself. Who else could he blame? He should have stopped his partner from leaving, should home to help him regardless of what his superiors said. But blaming himself proved to be too painful for the already broken man. So he set his sights on the military. On his leaders. They should have sent something. Anything! But they didn't care. With sheer scorn in his heart, Roza abandoned the military, too furious to ever entertain the idea of following orders ever again. No, he would have to do things his way. He became a mercenary for hire, settling into Mistral's infamous underworld and beginning his brand new career as a man who would never follow orders. Orders got people killed.

        The first part of his History is very solid and explains his younger self very well. I like the way it introduces the change in Roza's personality. Though there are few things that bother me with this particular event. You say Roza has come across devestation and similar situations before, doesn't that mean he would KNOW that sooner or later something like that could happen to him, or his friend? I mean, maybe that's still some of his naitivity showing through. I can't tell how old he would have been when Kuriyuri happened. I'm guessing at 23-26?


        At 25ish with several years in the military already shouldn't he know that sometimes there is nothing to be done?


        Also, I want to point out that him becoming a Mercenary is rather... tragic. He became a Mercenary to never follow orders, but isn't that exactly what a mercenary is? Someone who gets hired, fulfills an order, and then gets monetary rewards for it? Doesn't that mean he managed to 'enslave' himself to orders once again?


        Aside from that I can't find anything else to criticise. 


    ------

    All in All Roza is a very well thought out AND fleshed out character. He is very well balanced and sounds realistic and believable.


    I do like the way you presented this entire bio: It is thourough, yet easy to read. Sometimes you could explain things with a few less words but it's rarely an issue. I have no complaints about the character itself, just those two things I mentioned for his History.


    I honestly have nothing else to say because this is basically a character as perfect as perfect gets!
    Well done, Mono ! (And believe me I was trying to find things to criticise because I didn't want it to look like I was jsut blindly praising you because we are friends, but there is honestly barely anything to criticise in the first place ! )

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33574956 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD

    Yes.

    Extremely bad bone breaks can in fact result in that we are talking some serious breaks here though. I am not sure where the medical line would be but having bone breaks so bad its more shards of bone then an actual whole bone would be along the lines from my understanding.

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574957 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja It was a massive gorilla type Grimm...I mean Alpha Silverback massive!!

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33574965 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD

    Then a bad hit across the arms might do it and mangle his arms...you would need to explain how that happens in such a way it doesnt kill him or continue on and crush his ribs since something THAT powerful as to break your arms that badly would hit your ribs as well.

    Hmmm

    Possibly getting knocked down a hill the hit drains his aura and rolling down the hill he hits rocks which breaks his arms. His legs not being damaged can be explained as luck.


    Mind you this is going to HURT a lot possible even pass out from pain levels....not possible most likely I think.

  • Capcans2

    Capcans2

    #33574975 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    You mean something like this?

  • Malochroma

    Malochroma FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Treenerd Hugger

    #33574980 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD


    Gorilla Grimm are known as Beringel, FYI, and they're pretty dang big. (Concept art from Erin Winn has them at being about twice as tall as Ruby, give or take.)

  • GrisellJumpTJD

    GrisellJumpTJD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33574982 - 5 months ago

    Maybe thrown backwards into a tree might suit Brock 

  • Monodramatic

    Monodramatic

    #33574991 - 5 months ago

    In reply to RoseMaryM

    Frammento is the Italian word for "fragment", according to Google translate.


    Ooooh, I think some rings might fit his look nicely, actually! Will probably add some of those. And, yeah, hairy arms. 


    I'll probably say he wears jeans, those seem to fit the aesthetic nicely.


    His weapons are sort of intentionally simple. I thought giving them ranged capabilities might be a bit much, since they're already incredibly versatile at close range, and keeping them melee-exclusive ensured that he still had some notable weakness. That being said, I feel like between his Semblance and overall speed and mobility, he does have a way to fight ranged characters. It's just harder for him.


    I know bubbles are spheres sorry dunno why I wrote that Orz


    As far as his history goes, it's a bit tricky. I want to say that his anger wasn't as much to do with naivety as it was with how close him and his partner were. Of course, in the end, Roza's view is flawed, but that's intentional. The fact that he had gone through a lot with his partner, and felt that he could have saved them, accounts for his decision at the time. That being said, the idea that he should have known it was nobody's fault is something that comes up in the story I'm planning to write, it's more than just flaws logic.


    The idea behind him becoming a Mercenary is that he gets to choose what work to do, as opposed to having to follow strict guidelines and whatnot. It's sort of like, since he decides what rules to abide by, he isn't really restricted? I'm sure you get what I mean, it just offers a lot more freedom!



    Thanks for the review! I know I can get a bit wordy at times, but I'm still unsure how to avoid that, since it doesn't really feel like there's anything here that could be left out. I'm really glad you did find things to criticise, actually. I need to re-enforce the idea that I suck somehow

  • thesonofcinder

    thesonofcinder

    #33574988 - 5 months ago

    Daniel Samuels.

    species :faunus

    type: goat 

    role: student (beacon academy)

    weapon: gun and staff (two different weapons)

    height: 5'9

    eyes: green

    hair: rust red

    clothing: ripped jeans, leather jacket, sneakers

    personality: reclusive, introvert with rare bursts of negative or positive emotion.

    semblance: the ability to create up to 10 perfect copies of himself, these copies leech off his aura and get weaker the more that are in existence. explode into black smoke when killed.

    aura: strong

    series: G.O.L.D

  • Monodramatic

    Monodramatic

    #33574994 - 5 months ago

    In reply to thesonofcinder


    So, uh, you didn't really describe your character's personality? You listed a few traits that could literally fit an entire archetype of characters. I have no idea who this person is and how they're different from any other reclusive introvert with rare bursts of negative or positive emotion.


    Also, you could literally just write "Semblance: Shadow Clone Jutsu - Edgy Black Smoke edition"

  • Malochroma

    Malochroma FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Treenerd Hugger

    #33575000 - 5 months ago

    In reply to thesonofcinder


    RWBY Character Naming Guidelines


    Comprehensive List of RWBY-friendly Color Names

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33575003 - 5 months ago

    In reply to Malochroma

    Not to nitpick but an actual question here.

    Samuels means in hebrew Name of god or God has heard.

    Glynda means Fair or good with the implication of white.


    Since in many religions God is everything couldnt the same idea be used? That God is ALL colors?

  • thesonofcinder

    thesonofcinder

    #33575004 - 5 months ago

    In reply to Monodramatic

    lets see, his dad abandoned him when he was young, he watched several of his best friends die in front of him, he is afraid of getting attached to people because he is on the run from the white fang, he has nightmares every night of the monster that killed his friends. he is strong and feels that it is his duty to protect the world alone. and says that he would probably be happier if he let a Grimm kill him, but can't because of the felling i stated above.



    enough information for you?

    also, its been a while since i saw narito, can shadow clone jutsu make copies that can actually fight or not?

  • Tuckapenguin

    Tuckapenguin FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33575005 - 5 months ago

    In reply to GriselllJumpTJD


    One thing that will really help your OC being accepted is a nice, clear bio layout. Jumping around from name to relationships to history willy nilly can throw reader off. It also encourages detail and focus. I know the forum has a great little bio layout but I'm a lazy bastard and won't chase it down (Does anyone else have it for the fella?). Here's one I use Bio Template

    Brocky!!!! Now I get that reference but most won't.  The Brook part of Brookvale might meet the colour name rule but if you can find something closer you'll get more brownie points.


    Nailing down his age will help us form a better mental image of him both physically and mentally. In his case given his skills and weapons late twenties is much more believable than early twenties.


    I'm actually pretty okay with Canon/OC relationships provided they're paced and characters are still in character. Now Winter Schnee puts me in mind of a cold, career driven woman so you're going to have your work cut out for you that she's interested in a thrill seeker Brocky lends himself to be. 


    That's said I'd be careful how often you dip your pen in the canon ink. Beginners think that the way to integrate their OC in the canon is to be like a spider at the center of the web but really it takes a greater effort of suspension of disbelief every time there's a canon connection. Its possible he was the bloke who designed Yang's arm, but is it necessary? Winter, Yang, Penny, Ironwood... Simply stating it doesn't make me believe it.


    Kangaroo is good, unusual faunus type but its better to go into detail. What are his faunus features. Does Brocky have ears? Tail?  Feet like clown shoes? Any animal senses? Animal instincts? Although all it might mean is that he's a lazy bugger. 


    His semblance is pretty boring given that he references Peter Brock, kangaroos and Australia and a kangaroo. Speed, momentum, 'boxing', bouncing really high.....


    Weapon wise, if he's arms are both guns and swords his arms are going to be bulky and chunky. Choosing one or the other helps with suspension of disbelief.

     

    I look to the personality first to figure out how much I like a character. Right now he's vague and scattered and damn it needs a grammar hammer. Take your time, a consistent character is more likeable than a kewl character.


    One thing I do find weird however is why Brock 'King of the Mountain and the V8 engine has a hovercycle? There's a disconnect there. I'm not much educated on Aussie motocross star but you might be able to nail one down. 


    Don't go chasing that 'monkey ripped off his arms' plot line. Half a dozen people have told you they won't believe or accept it as a possibility. I'll tell you blood loss is immediate and lethal. If nine out of ten readers tell you don't like it, you lose readers. My thoughts are, he's an engineer working with dangerous machinery. There's every chance there was an accident that mangled both arms, and while within immediate medical care provided by those hotshot Atlas Doctors were able to save his life.


    In reply to thesonofcinder

    Wrong fandom mate, we're RWBY not Naruto. 


    I think you're writing about Daniel Samuel's directly into the Comment Box. I heartily discourage this because it looks hasty, and without thought. When this thread has hundreds of beautiful, well laid out and thoughtful characters, you're asking them to rate a gorgeous wedding cake compared to a mudpie. You're not going to like the results.


    Rather than do that, why not make yourself a place where you can keep and edit 'Daniel'. Google Docs is great for that. Take your time. Haste makes waste. People would rather rather wait two days to read a thoughtful, detailed character and will outright ignore an OC made in five minutes. When people like a character, they reply warmly and encourage you to continue. There are some wonderful people on this thread that when impressed may even draw your OC. Take that time to make it worth our time.


    Again, Bio Template . If you watch RWBY, you'll see Ozpin explain that kids in Remnant are named after colours. This is a rule. It has been stated by the creator Monty Oum that whenever he made a character or a team it had to relate to his character. People like to read about characters who obey the rules. Malochroma gave you some fantastic resources for really cool colour names.


    I like the idea of a goat faunus, but go deeper and tell us about what kind of faunus features he has.  Other than that he's very bland and basic. His backstory is a joke and reminds me of this scene. I was not moved to sympathy or empathy for Daniel, I sniggered and thought of

    this scene from Robin Hood Men in Tights. (I've got to make a gif of this, I use it too often in the RWBY fandom).


    Take your time and we'll appreciate it!



  • Monodramatic

    Monodramatic

    #33575014 - 5 months ago

    In reply to thesonofcinder

    Ok. This is better. A little on the edgy side of things, but we can make it work. The idea of a jaded character who fears the emotional burden of relationships due to his situation having to tussle with his own morality and desire to protect people is a solid basis for a character with some interesting potential. I feel like you'd benefit from giving the guy a few more quirks or nuances to really define him, though. What's he like on the surface? Cold, aloof and rude? Or does he feign a lackadaisical persona?


    How old is he, by the way? 


    Also, you haven't told us the colors of his clothing. That's very important.


    And, yes, Shadow Clones could fight. They did exactly what this character's Semblance does, actually. 

  • Malochroma

    Malochroma FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Treenerd Hugger

    #33575015 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja


    "Fair" is also a synonym for "pale, white," especially in relation to a person's complexion, which is where the color association comes from for the Welsh root that Glynda (and a lot of glyn/gwen/guin Welsh names) come from.

  • Monodramatic

    Monodramatic

    #33575022 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    I feel like that's a bit of a stretch. I mean, there is a bit of logic there, but going by the rule of common association, God doesn't generally seem to be linked to color at all. Not specifically, at least. And because there's no common association between God and color specifically, linking him to every color because certain religions believe God to be everything strikes me as bending the rule a bit too much.